Legislature(2005 - 2006)HOUSE FINANCE 519

05/05/2005 01:30 PM House FINANCE


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ HB 291 WORKERS' COMPENSATION RECORDS TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ HB 297 OIL& GAS EXPLORATION CREDIT & LEASE TERMS TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ HCR 12 LEG TASK FORCE ON RURAL SUSTAINABILITY TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHCR 12(FIN) Out of Committee
+ SB 142 REGIONAL SCHOOL BD LAND OWNERSHIP TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ SB 144 EMISSION CONTROL PROGRAM PERMITS/REGS TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ SB 150 ALASKA CHILDREN'S TRUST FUND GRANTS TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ SB 130 WORKERS' COMPENSATION/ INSURANCE TELECONFERENCED
<Pending Referral>
+= HB 106 SENIOR CARE PROGRAM TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 106(FIN) Out of Committee
= SB 110 POLLUTION DISCHARGE & WASTE TRMT/DISPOSAL
Moved HCS CSSB 110(FIN) Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 110(FIN)(efd fld)                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     An Act relating to regulation of the discharge of                                                                          
     pollutants under the National Pollutant Discharge                                                                          
     Elimination System.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:40:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair   Stoltze  MOVED   to  ADOPT   Amendment  #4   for                                                                   
Representative Seaton.  Vice-Chair Stoltze OBJECTED.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
KURT FREDRIKSSON,  COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT  OF ENVIRONMENTAL                                                                   
CONSERVATION,  explained  that   the  Department  intends  to                                                                   
continue the  work group to  help develop the  bill proposal.                                                                   
The original intent of the work  group was to help those most                                                                   
affected  in   their  attempt   to  get  approval   from  the                                                                   
Environmental  Protection  Agency  (EPA).    All  work  group                                                                   
activities are public  noticed for comment.   He thought that                                                                   
Amendment #4 would  create a more formal process.   He stated                                                                   
it was unnecessary  because the Administrative  Procedure Act                                                                   
already clearly addresses that.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair Stoltze WITHDREW his OBJECTION.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Meyer OBJECTED.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote  was taken on the motion to  adopt Amendment                                                                   
#4.                                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
IN FAVOR:      Stoltze, Croft, Joule, Kelly                                                                                     
OPPOSED:       Foster, Hawker, Holm, Meyer, Chenault                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Moses and Representative  Weyhrauch  were not                                                                   
present for the vote.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
The MOTION FAILED (4-5).                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair   Stoltze  MOVED   to  ADOPT   Amendment  #5   for                                                                   
Representative Seaton.  Vice-Chair Stoltze OBJECTED.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Commissioner Fredriksson  explained that the  amendment would                                                                   
insert language  on Page 5,  Line 13, after "program"  adding                                                                   
"or  comments  on  a  draft permit".    The  work  group  has                                                                   
attempted to  draw up the appropriate  language.    There are                                                                   
laws requiring a review if substantive  changes are made.  He                                                                   
thought it  would place  an obligation  on the Department  to                                                                   
discuss  changes   with  all  parties  and   urged  that  the                                                                   
amendment  not move  forward.   He guaranteed  that if  there                                                                   
were  significant changes  made,  the Department  is  already                                                                   
required to offer a significant review.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze WITHDREW his  OBJECTION.   Representative                                                                   
Kelly OBJECTED.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:47:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Joule   asked   who   defines   "significant                                                                   
changes".  Commissioner  Fredriksson replied it  would be the                                                                   
Department with respect to rule making and permitting.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Chenault  inquired   if  the  Department  would  be                                                                   
required  to discuss  all  comments regarding  that  process.                                                                   
Commissioner Fredriksson said they would.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:48:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze WITHDREW  Amendment #5.   There  being NO                                                                   
OBJECTION, it was withdrawn.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze  recommended that  the  bill  be held  in                                                                   
Committee so  that Representative Weyhrauch could  be present                                                                   
to add his comments.    Co-Chair Meyer agreed  but noted that                                                                   
it was  his intent  to move  the bill  from Committee  at the                                                                   
morning meeting.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SB 110 was HELD for further consideration.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 110(FIN)(efd fld)                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     An Act relating to regulation of the discharge of                                                                          
     pollutants under the National Pollutant Discharge                                                                          
     Elimination System.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch MOVED to ADOPT Amendment #1, #24-                                                                      
GS1009\GA.2, Bullock, 5/4/05.  Vice-Chair Stoltze OBJECTED.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch noted that  he would like  to amend                                                                   
Amendment #1,  by deleting  Lines 1-9.   The language  of the                                                                   
amendment would insert a new bill  section, Page 6, following                                                                   
Line 1, which  would clarify the duties of  the Department of                                                                   
Environmental Conservation.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Hawker  OBJECTED  to  the  deletion  of  that                                                                   
language.  Representative  Weyhrauch advised that  the intent                                                                   
was  only to  replace  that section  and  then  create a  new                                                                   
Section 6.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:04:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  reiterated  his intent  to  delete                                                                   
Lines 1-9 and replace with deleted Section 1.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Representative Hawker  WITHDREW his OBJECTION.   Commissioner                                                                   
Fredriksson interjected that the  Department had no objection                                                                   
to the change.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:05:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Kelly   referenced  Line  16   (B)  regarding                                                                   
establishing the work  group, and asked why EPA  had not been                                                                   
included.  Representative Weyhrauch  explained that the "work                                                                   
group"  language  had  originated  in  the  Governor's  bill.                                                                   
Commissioner Fredriksson  added, the intent was  to establish                                                                   
a working  group regulated by  the program and  involving EPA                                                                   
only  to  the  extent  that  the   application  passes  their                                                                   
approval.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Vice Chair  Stoltze WITHDREW his  OBJECTION.  There  being NO                                                                   
further OBJECTION, Amendment #1 was adopted.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:07:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch MOVED to ADOPT Amendment #2, #24-                                                                      
GS1009\GA.3, Bullock, 5/4/05.  Vice-Chair Stoltze OBJECTED.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch explained  that the amendment mostly                                                                   
addressed  grammatical   editing  language.     The  proposed                                                                   
verbiage simply makes it easier to read and understand.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:09:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Joule requested  clarification regarding those                                                                   
changes.  Representative Weyhrauch explained the need.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:10:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Commissioner  Fredriksson  acknowledged  that  the  amendment                                                                   
provides a  technical clarification  and that the  Department                                                                   
would not object.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:10:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  MOVED a  change  to Amendment  #2.                                                                   
(Copy on File).   The language inserts a new  Section (J): "A                                                                   
person who  applies for  a permit under  the program  has the                                                                   
opportunity to review a proposed  final permit and discuss it                                                                   
with staff  of the  department before  the department  issues                                                                   
the permit".   There  being NO  OBJECTION, the amendment  was                                                                   
amended.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:10:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze  WITHDREW  his OBJECTION.    Commissioner                                                                   
Fredriksson agreed  to proposed  changes.  Amended  Amendment                                                                   
#2 was adopted.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:12:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch WITHDREW Amendment #3.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze  MOVED  to  RESCIND  previous  action  on                                                                   
failure to  adopt Amendment  #4.   There being NO  OBJECTION,                                                                   
the action was rescinded.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:13:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair Stoltze MOVED to ADOPT  Amendment #4 in order that                                                                   
the  sponsor  be able  to  address  it.   Vice-Chair  Stoltze                                                                   
OBJECTED.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PAUL SEATON advised  the language was added in                                                                   
the  House  Resources  Committee.    He  indicated  that  the                                                                   
developed  permitting  process allows  public  access to  the                                                                   
work group.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Commissioner  Fredriksson  spoke  against the  amendment.  He                                                                   
indicated that the Department  recognizes their obligation to                                                                   
the public review  process.  The Department  annually reports                                                                   
to  the  Governor  and  the Legislature  and  should  not  be                                                                   
required  to   go  through  an  administrative   rule  making                                                                   
process.  The Department would not support the amendment.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:17:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  asked if  there  were federal  EPA                                                                   
requirements  for public  notice of  meetings.   Commissioner                                                                   
Fredriksson did  not know the  process required for EPA.   He                                                                   
noted that  all meetings  regarding the proposed  legislation                                                                   
had  been  public   noticed;  however,  there   had  been  no                                                                   
administrative  rule  making  process.   The  Department  was                                                                   
focused on establishing  a work group affected  and regulated                                                                   
by the program.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:18:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch  asked if the meetings  were subject                                                                   
to Alaskan law Open Meetings Act.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:19:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CAMERON  LEONARD, (TESTIFIED  VIA TELECONFERENCE),  ASSISTANT                                                                   
ATTORNEY  GENERAL, DEPARTMENT  OF  LAW, ANCHORAGE,  explained                                                                   
that under  the Open  Meetings  Act, a meeting  of that  type                                                                   
would not be  subject to those requirements.   Normally, only                                                                   
government  entities   with  decision-making   authority  are                                                                   
subject.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch asked  if it  was the  Department's                                                                   
intent  to provide  public notice  if the  amendment was  not                                                                   
enacted.   Commissioner  Fredriksson  replied the  Department                                                                   
has in the past and does intend to in the future.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:19:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Seaton  interjected that if the  public is not                                                                   
involved in the front-end process,  ultimately, there will be                                                                   
problems d.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze WITHDREW his  OBJECTION.   Representative                                                                   
Weyhrauch OBJECTED.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was taken on the motion.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
IN FAVOR:      Joule, Stoltze, Weyhrauch, Chenault                                                                              
OPPOSED:       Foster, Hawker, Holm, Kelly, Meyer                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Croft  and  Representative   Moses  were  not                                                                   
present for the vote.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
The MOTION FAILED (4-5).                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:21:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair   Stoltze    MOVED   to   ADOPT    Amendment   #5.                                                                   
Representative Kelly OBJECTED.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Seaton explained  that  the amendment  allows                                                                   
the permittee  to  comment on  the draft with  the intent  to                                                                   
make  a   more  open   process.    Commissioner   Fredriksson                                                                   
countered  that  the  Department's   idea  is  to  allow  the                                                                   
opportunity  for the  permit recipient  to "have  a look"  in                                                                   
case something  technical was missing.   He stated  there are                                                                   
opportunities for  appeal rights  for both the  applicant and                                                                   
      rd                                                                                                                        
the  3  parties.    If there  were significant  changes  made                                                                   
during  the public  comment  period,  the Department  has  an                                                                   
obligation to  go back to  the public  for the changes  to be                                                                   
addressed.   He believed the  amendment was not  necessary to                                                                   
protect the public's interest.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:25:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  commented  on  potential  problems                                                                   
resulting from  public interest groups sending  mass mailings                                                                   
regarding   their   specific   concerns.     He   asked   how                                                                   
Representative Seaton would address that situation.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Seaton  explained  that  regulators  are  not                                                                   
allowed  to  draft   opinions  before  they  come   up.    He                                                                   
reiterated it would end up in  Court because only one side is                                                                   
being allowed to testify on the permit process.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:27:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch  noted language on Page  5, Line 12,                                                                   
regarding  the public  process period.   The  permit is  made                                                                   
public  following an  internal  review and  all comments  and                                                                   
emails  are subject to  disclosure under  the Public  Records                                                                   
Act.    Representative   Seaton  argued  the   need  for  the                                                                   
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:29:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Kelly  questioned how it would  "play out"; he                                                                   
thought that getting parties together  could be difficult and                                                                   
spoke against the amendment.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:31:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was taken on the motion.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
IN FAVOR:      Croft                                                                                                            
OPPOSED:       Foster,   Hawker,    Holm,   Kelly,   Stoltze,                                                                   
               Weyhrauch, Meyer, Chenault                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Joule  and  Representative   Moses  were  not                                                                   
present for the vote.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
The MOTION FAILED (1-8).                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Foster MOVED to  REPORT HCS  CS SB  110 (FIN)                                                                   
out  of Committee  with individual  recommendations and  with                                                                   
the accompanying  fiscal note.  There being  NO OBJECTION, it                                                                   
was so ordered.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
HCS CS  SB 110  (FIN) was  reported out  of Committee  with a                                                                   
"no" recommendation  and with zero note #1  by the Department                                                                   
of Fish  & Game, zero  note #2 by  the Department  of Natural                                                                   
Resources, zero  note #4 by the Department  of Transportation                                                                   
& Public Facilities  and fiscal note #5 by  the Department of                                                                   
Environmental Conservation.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                

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